Graphic by Cal |
I had let my students know that I expected them to be on their best behavior and to show their appreciation that someone else cared enough help them find a job. For the most part, my students are engaged (they're senior majors), and I only have 3-4 who simply check out. But for some reason today, they all turned into snowflakey misfits. I wish I had never bothered to care about their welfare beyond the classroom:
Maternal Mathilda greeted the guest effusively by hugging her and welcoming her to the class and offering her "some gum." Maternal Mathilda then proceeded to sit in the front row, 'unseating' Overachieving Olga, who typically sits there, wherein a scuffle of sorts occurred, and I hissed at the students to settle it amongst themselves and not embarrass themselves.
Texting Tommy, true to form, walked in with his iPhone attached to his hand, where it stayed for the remainder of the class. I am pretty sure he did not even realize we had a guest lecturer.
One half of the class (four students who are usually engaged) promptly propped themselves up against the wall and fell asleep. I am not sure if they all stayed up gaming last night, but it was as if they'd planned this as a 'non-class' day.
Baleful Bob contributed that he didn't know why we bothered to talk about anything in the future because we were all going to die at the end of 2012, anyway. This is not the first time Bob has contributed this idea. The class knows to ignore him. My guest lecturer did not. She did what all seasoned professors know not to do: she engaged Bob in conversation. And Bob then proceeded to sigh and pronounce conspiratorial doom for three solid minutes before his neighbor cough/sneezed 'shut up!' (is there a verb for that? if not, we need one for the fake sneeze/cough message).
By the end of class, my guest had given up on everyone but the front row. That was the extent of her audience.
Today’s guest was by no means boring, but she presented her information like she was talking to a conference audience. I had warned her about the texters and talkers, and she had agreed that this was just par for the course. She was professional, had an organized presentation that was relevant to students hungering for jobs. Her voice was not annoying, and she did not exhibit any odd tics or snorts. She was sharing valuable information. And yet, she simply could not engage the students.
I have invited guest lecturers to speak to my classes before. The ones who usually do really well are already educators (high school teachers and other professors). Those in the 'industry' do not seem to know how to maintain or engage students' attention. One droned on in a monotone voice for 45 minutes before looking up from his notes. Another started to hit on the attractive married Mormon in the front row. A final disastrous guest had a psychotic episode during class and thought he was seeing sharks swimming outside the window (I cannot make up this level of crazy).
I think I’m doing the best I can with my audience. I am not an overly gregarious individual, but I spend a lot of energy and time trying to be more engaging because I have been told that if I am not engaging, I’m not doing my job to gain their attention so they can then learn. I change my presentation of material that didn’t go over well, come up with active learning strategies, incorporate real-life examples, infuse my lesson plans with relevant multimedia examples, and assign tasks that require students to employ critical thinking skills beyond memorization and regurgitation.
But I started to wonder if we educators spend too much energy (or maybe it’s just me) using techniques to engage students, when, in fact, in the work force, no one is going to put forth that much effort. I am doing what my school encourages me to do: find alternate ways to reach the snowflakes. But in doing so, am I hurting them by catering to their need to always be entertained by finding better ways to engage them when simple lecture and activities do not do the trick? Am I doing them a disservice by spending hours coming up with active learning techniques and ways to encourage them to learn material, when I could just be going ‘old school’ and lecturing from notes? Should I be more like my guest lecturer, who expected them to behave as professionals, rather than changing her lecture style to suit their need to always be stimulated?
What have your experiences with guest lecturers been, or thoughts on whether we do students a disservice by trying to engage them?
Guest lecturer?
ReplyDeleteNice no class.
http://www.quickmeme.com/meme/35to7y/
Excuse me, but this is for adults who want to learn, not you.
DeleteI teach in a department/area we regularly have guest lecturers coming through, many of whom end up speaking to one class or another. I usually sit at the back of the room, and the number of students visibly on their phones or i-pads or playing games/watching movies/diddling with Facebook on their laptops long astonished me. We now ban laptops from most classes, but that doesn't increase students' attentiveness. There are always exceptions, but it seems like -- as always -- students mostly ignore something if it isn't going to be on "the exam".
ReplyDeleteI agree with the point about doing our students a disservice. Too much of what passes for paedagogical innovation at university these days is simply the development of tricks to get students to be more involved. But as I say, future employers aren't going to go out of their way to motivate employees to come to work, do their work, and find meaning in their work. The taxman isn't going to send out lots of polite reminders about upcoming filing deadlines. The bank isn't going to check that clients have read and understand all the details of a mortgage.... If students can't motivate themselves they should be prepared to fail.
Of course I'm writing this during a break from crafting bizarrely convoluted answers to may administration's bizarrely convoluted requests for course outcomes, undergraduate degree-level expectations, etc. etc.
Please note that I have previously posted using my standard Google identity, "Steve", 'cause that's sort of my name. But since I intend to become a bit more active here, and since everyone seems to have catchy handles, and since I don't want to be bounced for posting under multiple aliases, I'm just publicly announcing that the man who was "Steve" will herein be Doctor BPD (under which I have posted comments elsewhere). Moderator: is that o.k.?
ReplyDeleteAnd sorry about that double posting above--not sure how that happened.
Thanks for the head's up.
DeleteThe RGM
I faced the same embarrassment when I was teaching a college class to high school kids over the summer. The class was based mostly on guest lecturers, and I put a lot of work into finding some really great guest lecturers--interesting ones, famous ones, engaging ones, etc. These were all people who'd agreed to speak out of the goodness of their hearts, no honoraria or anything.
ReplyDeleteAfter seeing how the students treated them, I wished I'd never invited them.
No matter how many times I tried to impress the students with the speakers' credentials, no matter how I reminded them that their parents were paying $2000 for them to sit in this room and get this kind of exposure to Real College Proffies, no matter how often I implored them to practice basic human decency and respect the person at the front of the room, I still had texters, sleepers, chatters, and kids who put on earphones and tuned out.
Because it was this Special Summer Program, I didn't feel confident enough to kick anyone out, because I worried that parents would contact the university about how they weren't paying for a summer class just for their little darlings to sit in the hall. But if I had to do it again, I would have kicked out half the class. Nothing is more embarrassing than having someone come do you a favor--giving a free lecture to your students--only to have the students mistreat that person.
I think you picked a useful guest speaker who could have provided an answer to the eternal snowflake question: "But what are we gonna dooooo with this stuff?"
ReplyDeleteToo bad most of your students were beyond ungrateful. Hopefully a few in the front row got something out of it.
I guess I'm of the opinion that a professor should go all out for the students who care, and to hell with the ones who don't.
Unfortunately, I realize that retention, student evaluations, tenure review processes and so on all conflict with this tactic...
> Unfortunately, I realize that retention, student evaluations,
Delete> tenure review processes and so on all conflict with this tactic...
This is why "corrupt" is not too strong of a word to describe what college has devolved into.
Ruby,
ReplyDeleteI had the same experience with an upper division class designed to explore social problems. I invited people from various organizations and agencies. People ate, texted, and arrived late regularly. When I asked which speakers they felt were the best, it was the ones from not-for-profits that had professionally designed PowerPoint presentations.
Now you know why I no longer invite general-ed students to physics colloquia. It's embarrassing: these talks are by grown-ups, for grown-ups, and the kids act so shamelessly like kids.
DeleteI think you did your guest lecturer a favor, as it sounds like most of those students are potential job applicants she can write off immediately.
ReplyDeleteI must also say that I strongly approve of Bob's plan for the future, it sounds like a good one.
I started to wonder if we educators spend too much energy (or maybe it’s just me) using techniques to engage students, when, in fact, in the work force, no one is going to put forth
ReplyDeletethat much effort.
That's something worth putting in our syllabi.
I don't have a good answer, except that professional conferences have engaging speakers as well as boring ones. If you want to get anything from them, you still have to pay attention.
The question of whether we should expect students to behave as professionals... where do you think they see that modeled? In movies? In their peer group? WTF?
Nevertheless, the answer is probably "yes." Explicitly, too.
FYI: I don't see your wonderful insights here as limited to a syllabus entry: you still raise the question within a larger picture, not limiting it to a simple policy fix.
DeleteOff topic: Cal, that graphic is brilliant.
ReplyDeleteCynic--why are your students texting and talking in your class? That shouldn't be something you have to deal with--let alone a guest lecturer.
ReplyDeleteBut in answer to your question, in my experience some classes are just hopeless. Every class is like a person--it has its own personality. And some classes--like some people--are just dead weight.
I once had a job candidate "sub" for me during a class for her teaching presentation. I'd warned the chair of the hiring committee that these students were intractably nonparticipatory. Slack-jawed and staring no matter how they were penalized or what sort of dynamite I set under them. The other section of that course was fine. These students? On thorazine or something, every last one. Like McMurphy before Chief pushed a pillow into his face. Hopeless.
But get those bastards to at least stop chatting and texting and facebooking and whatnot. As for Maternal Mathilda--Jeebuz. My classroom atmosphere does not generally encourage hugging, but sometimes you can't stop these things. A student tried to hug me once. I went as stiff as the queen and she left off pretty quick. But guest lecturers have to fend for themselves in these kinds of things.
Clearly, they're texting and talking in my class because I'm a horrible professor and don't know how to teach well. Is there any other answer? :o)
DeleteAnd for the record, Maternal Mathilda has never attempted to hug me. She does, however, hug everyone else who allows her near. She also willingly lends her writing utensils, distributes candy or mints or bandaids, and takes pride in being the 'mother' of the class. She's 18 and reminds me of my grandma.
DeleteI haven't been out of college that long myself, but it was long enough ago that powerpoint presentations and other media embellishments weren't the order of the day. Most of my professors led effective class discussions with few bells and whistles.
ReplyDeleteI have no idea how they did it. If I don't walk into each class with a bouncing ball that my students can follow--powerpoints, film clips, real-world examples that they find "relatable," carefully structured interactive group work (you can't just tell them to get into a group and think about such-and-such--you have to make sure that they have a list of instructions and an incentive to complete the work)--I'm not keeping their attention. Even with all that stuff, I'm still not keeping the attention of many of them.
The most common complaint about me and most people I know, in fact, is that we're boring. And you know, we probably are. I find my area fascinating, but I didn't when I was 19. But that's the thing: at 19, I didn't EXPECT to be excited and entertained when going to class. We all thought school was boring, but it was SUPPOSED to be boring. Paying attention required some discipline. It's work. It's a job. Most jobs aren't interesting. In life, you devote x number of hours to being bored, and then you do something else for entertainment.
I don't understand the whole "we need to entertain" concept, either. I was told since elementary school that college professors were masters of their classrooms, and they could kick you out of class forever for minor misbehavior. When I went to a SLAC, I was happy that I could actually go to class without all the drama and rudeness you find in K-12 schools. There were a few acts of misbehavior I witnessed, yet it usually was dealt with quickly and never happened again. There were slackers, sure, but they rarely interfered with everyone else's attempts to learn. If anyone did do anything stupid to interrupt the class, the rest of the students were.. erm... more than willing to express their disapproval of the rude student's behavior. This was in the early 2000s when I went. It is mind-boggling to me what professors endure with misbehaving college students. I never would have believed it if I did not read it here on CM.
DeleteThe only "entertainment" I ever got out of my college professors was knowledge, some friendships, and their eccentricities. :)
I don't use guest speakers too often, but I haven't had much trouble. Being at a church-affiliated SLAC with relatively small classes helps here.
ReplyDeleteI'm at a church-affiliated SLAC, too, so I'm curious why that would help... perhaps your SLAC doesn't have an open admission policy like ours seems to have (although it claims not to *scoff scoff*).
DeleteWe aren't quite open admissions. I think we take about 65%. There are a few students who have no business being here, of course, but overall most of them can do the work -- if they try.
DeletePerhaps I'm just confused: I still don't see how that has anything to do with guest lecturers... or maybe you meant you don't have to worry as much about snowflakes??? :o)
Delete"Your future bosses, assuming you ever get a job, will not put 10% of the effort into keeping your attention as I do." I like the sound of that.
ReplyDeleteOTOH, these students will be several years older and in a different environment when they get a job. When the workplace is a campus, built to maximize their enjoyment, they goof off. When the workplace is actually a place to do work, they work.
Good point. I was guilty of sleeping through many a general ed. class.
DeleteIt is a bit lol worthy that you profs are all thinking "hmmm what can I put in the syllabus to fix this?". Here's a hint: I only look at the syllabus to find the exam dates and what % they are of the final grade. You're wasting your time doing anything more than that.
ReplyDeleteLectures in general I look at is as I'm paying to be there. If I want to pay attention or jerk off for 50 minutes then that's my choice. In a professional environment it's a completely different story. When you're the one paying me you have 100% of my attention for 8 hours.
Heaven forbid you actually learn anything, of potential value for any kind of job that requires skill or knowledge in the real world. Chances are that with your astonishingly narrow mind, you can't see the value in much of anything taught in college. You really ought not to be there: it's a waste of your time, and of ours.
DeleteAnd here's what completely flummoxes me--and StockStalker, I SO look forward to your enlightening insight on this--Where the eff is the disconnect for students in recognizing that grades ARE a paycheck?!
DeleteI could respect Stockstalker's libertarian view, if students were more accepting of the low grades that come from sleeping/texting/etc through class. Sure they won't learn anything of potential value, but they'll bitch like hell if their grade reflects that fact. So I don't really try to police any behaviour that isn't disruptive to the students who actually try to learn (on the other hand, I'm less inclined to expose a guest lecturer to the same less-than-respectful behaviour).
DeleteAnd perhaps many students do look on grades as a paycheck, but one that can be obtained just by showing up. Or by whining. That same attitude does translate into the workplace for many people. A general economic principle is that you maximize profit for minimum expense/effort. So why pay for the cow if you can get the milk for free?
The problem is that the idea that there should be consequences for slacking off founders on the idea that we shouldn't fail too many students - because they are the customers who have to be kept happy.
Yeah, you're right, SS, and what I'm getting paid for is to fail student who act like you -- which I will. With phrases like "
DeleteLectures in general I look at is," though, you've clearly already failed somewhere. Or someone is getting paid but not paying attention to your lack of skills.
SS, we talk about adding clauses to our syllabus to cover our asses. When a faculty member creates his or her own rules for kicking students out of class for texting or failing them for not participating in discussions, the syllabus has to state that policy. It's the fine print which, admittedly, few students read. But then that's not my problem, it's yours.
Delete"Sure they won't learn anything of potential value, but they'll bitch like hell if their grade reflects that fact."
DeleteI concede that point. My attitude is if I fail then most of the time it's my fault but I guess I'm pretty unique in that.
Re: the syllabus. I've had professors make one ultra-harsh syllabus and then grade and run the class in a completely different way (with curves and everything). So if you bitched to him or grade grubbed or whatever he could default to the syllabus and REALLY rape you.
Smart prof.
DeleteStockStalker, no one has mentioned a syllabus here.Have you perhaps misinterpreted what we have been discussing? To me, we've focused primarily on discussing more effective ways to help students learn. We are all concerned with overall approaches to teaching, not specific ways to change a syllabus.
ReplyDeletePerhaps you're confusing this post with Hiram's one about the girl with the iPod (where SHE mentioned that it wasn't in the syllabus)???
Mea culpa.
DeleteThe end of dignity, or in other words (David Gelernter's, not mine) doing somersaults in the classroom, does do our students a disservice. Employers want workers who will listen during staff meetings, while not texting. The gimmicks that our higher-ups increasingly encourage us to do are just a ploy for them giving us larger, and larger, and larger classes, of ever-more resentful students. I could sympathize with them for this, but I reach my limits whenever I realize yet again how empty, unimaginative, and desperately dull their minds are. I learned a lot as an undergraduate in large lecture classes that were taught by profs who made no special effort to be entertaining (let's face it, "engaging" is just a code word for this): the key was for the profs to know their subject well, and present it in a prepared, organized manner.
ReplyDelete"how empty, unimaginative, and desperately dull their minds are."
ReplyDeleteThe students or the higher ups?
Or both?
My MIL, who works for a bank, fired someone for texting during a meeting. Then again, she's definitely Old School (and also did not get a college education, so that tells you how old she is--that she's gotten where she is--VP--without one).
ReplyDeleteI fucking hate texting during class and I will (and have) bounced students for doing it--and it's in my syllabus that I will--because they're a distraction to the people around them. I bounce them for being on FB, too. It's part of my "teach the ones who want to learn" program, which I can do now that I finally have tenure and don't have to bow (as much) to the customer service model of education we have these days. Don't want to pay attention? Doodle. Write a letter. [Write a what?] Or better yet, don't come at all, because we don't need you and your "empty, unimaginative, and desperately dull" little mind [h/t to Frod, who nailed it].
Good luck, SS, getting--much less keeping--a [non-Mc]job where you can do the bare minimum for your paycheck, or be disrespectful to the people in positions of authority who know *way* more than you do. Which is what a professor is: a person of authority who knows *way, way more* than you do, whether you like it, or believe it, or not. I suspect that you don't like it, and you must be a completely insufferable presence to whatever proffies are misfortunate enough to have you as a student, if you are, in fact, a student.
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DeleteYou lose all credibility when you devolve into childish personal attacks. You'd think someone who knows "way, way more than [I] do" would be aware of this.
DeleteNothing about BurntChrome's reply constituted a personal attack--just a sobering reminder that the "professional" world does not take kindly to childish behavior. Then again, this kind of over-personalization is very typical of the snowflake way: the inability to take criticism, the emphasis on "that hurt my feelings," the belief that one is entitled to respect all the time no matter how disrespectful one is to other people.
DeleteStockStalker is a troll and I would recommend not engaging anymore.
In response to what someone said (sorry, someone who posted earlier, whom I cannot find now): Are we simply treating them like children because they act like children, or are they acting like children because we treat them like children? Or is it even about that?
ReplyDelete