Perhaps this will lead to a discussion regarding the absurdity of Div I "college" sports. These are not student athletes. They are nominally students; they are unpaid athletes in system that makes hundreds of millions of dollars for everyone involved (except the athletes)--and those people will work to defend that system to the ends of the earth, regardless of the cost.
Also, Bubba, you are not shit.
I think Jon Stewart put it best: http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-november-10-2011/penn-state-riots
The first day this Paterno mess came up, I didn't know much. I'm still not inclined to trust the Penn State police or the State College police or any of JoePa's handlers or the media or the prosecutors in this matter, and I don't know if any of us will ever really know what happened. So I'd prefer not to comment much on the these recent events.
My experiences (as a proffie and administrator) with similar situations have been blazingly awful. The smattering of CM posts about such things have only scratched the surface. All this focus on Paterno is odd, when that case is just the tip of the iceberg--if even that. Reminds me of the scene when Rainman is counting cards in the casino and says to his brother that "there are lots and lots of them" (high cards). Well, likewise, there are lots and lots of Sanduskies. And while Rainman's brother told him that "counting cards is the cardinal sin" in casinos, there have been many times when I have felt that acknowledging the existence of all the sexual predators on colleges campuses is the cardinal sin.
There are lots and lots of Sanduskies. No case occurs in a vacuum, and no administrator inherits a clean and pure playing field. Sometimes it seems like there are Sanduskies as far as the eye can see. It's an ugly, ugly mess dreading waking up every day expecting to say to oneself, "jesus h christ… not again…." And it turns out that most of the people involved are lying about something. There are numerous secrets. Compromise after compromise is made in the interest of maintaining the school's image and simply keeping it running. It's like there are always at least eleven holes in the dike, but you only have ten fingers.
There might be CM readers who say, "Golly, Bubba, it sounds like you've been at some awful schools. My school has never had any Sanduskies." That's just naive. Talk to your president. Never mind, s/he won't tell you the truth. Trust me, they all have stories to tell. Penn State University, Oral Roberts University, expensive little SLACs, community colleges, wherever. They've all had their Sanduskies. Lots and lots of them.
40% of Harvard's students see the school's psychotherapists or psychiatrists. And probably at least another 10% of them have them have their own therapists outside the school. Just tons of them have been raped or abused as children or as college students. Why would we expect it to be better at other schools?
And what would you do if you had a Sandusky working for you? You'd fire him? But what if the person who you knew was most likely to replace him would be even more of a predator than Sandusky? You would make sure that that wouldn't happen, right? As if you are in complete control and all of this shit happens in a vacuum with no pre-existing compromises having been made? In my experience, it just doesn't usually happen like that. They are hard choices amid uncertainty and complexity. I'm reminded of the DeerHunter scene when I think of the cases I've seen. The uncertainty, having to take calculated risks to find a way out, with the best of intentions, of horrible situations. Not enough time, not enough resources, not enough trusted confidants.
Even if Graham Spanier had somehow completely shut down the Penn State football program, he still would have had numerous sexual predators on his campus. And on top of that, he would have employees embezzling millions of dollars and numerous other problems--and within a few years, there would again be 18-year-olds repeatedly slamming their heads against each other on a Penn State football field for little or no pay… and Spanier would have immediately lost his job.
People can say, "Raping is bad, saving the whales is good." Well, sure, that's easy to say. Who's going to disagree with that? But try to be the one who manages the neuroses of all the people at your school. Try to make it perfect. Try to eliminate everything that's bad. Try to do it in the context of the numerous settlements made by previous school presidents. Try to do it with all the fucktardedness that can't be uprooted.
Daily, I am haunted by these things and much, much more. I feel the utter despair of having made choices that just weren't good enough--like De Niro when he returned to Nam and tried so desperately to save his friend. There are so many times when you've got to work within the fucked-up system and play the fucked-up game in the current fucked-up culture, and accept the lesser of two evils (or the least of many evils).
I'm not defending any coach or any school administrator. I only know my own experiences. I just know that I have too often felt like De Niro at the end of that scene. And in that context, I know I have said, "I wish I had done more." But in the moment, and in the complexity, and in the fucked-up culture, and with all the limitations and secrets and compromises and so on, it's not easy at all to know what should have been done.
This is such an imperfectly-written comment, and I could just keep writing on and on and on. I'm reminded of the last scene in Schindler's List when Schindler realizes he could have sold his wedding ring and saved a few more Jews from being killed. Or in The Fog of War when Macnamara acknowledges that he made decisions as Secretary of Defense, knowing that a couple thousand troops would die because of his decision. Why I have movies on my mind this morning, I don't know. But this I would say: If you don't like the decisions being made by the chief, then why don't you be the chief and fix it all? It sounds harsh, doesn't it? You say you wouldn't be allowed to be the chief, right? The only way you could be the chief would be if you cut a deal or sold your soul or something? Right, it's painful and it's not easy.
I hate that scene in Schindler's List. Ruins the whole movie.
Not knowing the particulars of your situation, it's hard to say anything truly relevant or comforting. Maybe you don't deserve to feel better. I don't know.
I've not come across any pederasts, at least that I know, but I've certainly come across abusers. Teachers that harass their students. Many of them.
I was never in the position to do anything, because it was always rumor, always through a third party. Students and professors told me things about Professor X. No student that was actually harassed told me anything. Everyone knew the rumors were true. (Honestly, I've never heard bad shit like that about a prof that actually wasn't DOING bad shit.) But what could be done? I was not harassed. No student had come to me personally (in which case I would have been required to report it to the university).
Universities are no better than football programs, in many cases. They don't want a scandal. They don't want everything splashed all over the local papers. When push comes to shove, in my experience, the harasser just quietly resigns. But it takes a long time for that to happen. A LOOOOONG time. Harassers are very canny people. They usually choose their victims wisely. But eventually, they pick on the wrong person. A person with rich, influential parents. And then the university simply forces the harasser out.
There is one case...a gentleman of my particular vintage, who had been teaching at my university for 15 years, was abruptly fired. Not asked to resign. Fired. He was a very visible prof on campus, winner of the "professor of the year" award a few years ago. For as long as I've been here, I've heard the worst sort of things about him. Sex with every female student he could seduce, that sort of thing. It took 15 years for the pigeons to come home to roost.
You can take heart in that it actually is better than it was 25 years ago. Back then, I know of cases where a woman reported abuse and was told by the abuser's colleagues (one a woman) that it would be better for her not to report it, because people wouldn't believe her, and it would just make her look bad. Jesus.
The focus on Paterno is not odd, btw. It's perfectly understandable. Other people are far more guilty than he is, but it makes a better story to project most of the blame on him. And the scandal needs a lightning rod. No one knows who the administrators are. Everyone knows Joe Paterno.
It takes forever to get rid of an abuser. I know of one with a lengthy track record of targetting junior female academics in vulnerable positions (untenured; adjunct; just coming up for tenure that year; students). Even so, some of them have complained, and the university has a lengthy file on him. Has anything happened? Well, after another recent incident the university has finally decided to - form a committee to study the situation. I'm sure that will produce a speedy and fair resolution..
I am shit. Stella, please save me.
ReplyDeleteI have a word and a number for you. Write them down. John 3:16.
ReplyDeleteHA!!! Just kidding. Your REAL salvation is in the following:
Division III. Go and sin no more.
Division III. Amen.
ReplyDeletePerhaps this will lead to a discussion regarding the absurdity of Div I "college" sports. These are not student athletes. They are nominally students; they are unpaid athletes in system that makes hundreds of millions of dollars for everyone involved (except the athletes)--and those people will work to defend that system to the ends of the earth, regardless of the cost.
Also, Bubba, you are not shit.
I think Jon Stewart put it best: http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-november-10-2011/penn-state-riots
Why are you shit, Bubba?
ReplyDeleteMaybe you mean that power corrupts...?
ReplyDeleteDivision III. Ramen.
The first day this Paterno mess came up, I didn't know much. I'm still not inclined to trust the Penn State police or the State College police or any of JoePa's handlers or the media or the prosecutors in this matter, and I don't know if any of us will ever really know what happened. So I'd prefer not to comment much on the these recent events.
ReplyDeleteMy experiences (as a proffie and administrator) with similar situations have been blazingly awful. The smattering of CM posts about such things have only scratched the surface. All this focus on Paterno is odd, when that case is just the tip of the iceberg--if even that. Reminds me of the scene when Rainman is counting cards in the casino and says to his brother that "there are lots and lots of them" (high cards). Well, likewise, there are lots and lots of Sanduskies. And while Rainman's brother told him that "counting cards is the cardinal sin" in casinos, there have been many times when I have felt that acknowledging the existence of all the sexual predators on colleges campuses is the cardinal sin.
There are lots and lots of Sanduskies. No case occurs in a vacuum, and no administrator inherits a clean and pure playing field. Sometimes it seems like there are Sanduskies as far as the eye can see. It's an ugly, ugly mess dreading waking up every day expecting to say to oneself, "jesus h christ… not again…." And it turns out that most of the people involved are lying about something. There are numerous secrets. Compromise after compromise is made in the interest of maintaining the school's image and simply keeping it running. It's like there are always at least eleven holes in the dike, but you only have ten fingers.
There might be CM readers who say, "Golly, Bubba, it sounds like you've been at some awful schools. My school has never had any Sanduskies." That's just naive. Talk to your president. Never mind, s/he won't tell you the truth. Trust me, they all have stories to tell. Penn State University, Oral Roberts University, expensive little SLACs, community colleges, wherever. They've all had their Sanduskies. Lots and lots of them.
ReplyDelete40% of Harvard's students see the school's psychotherapists or psychiatrists. And probably at least another 10% of them have them have their own therapists outside the school. Just tons of them have been raped or abused as children or as college students. Why would we expect it to be better at other schools?
And what would you do if you had a Sandusky working for you? You'd fire him? But what if the person who you knew was most likely to replace him would be even more of a predator than Sandusky? You would make sure that that wouldn't happen, right? As if you are in complete control and all of this shit happens in a vacuum with no pre-existing compromises having been made? In my experience, it just doesn't usually happen like that. They are hard choices amid uncertainty and complexity. I'm reminded of the Deer Hunter scene when I think of the cases I've seen. The uncertainty, having to take calculated risks to find a way out, with the best of intentions, of horrible situations. Not enough time, not enough resources, not enough trusted confidants.
Even if Graham Spanier had somehow completely shut down the Penn State football program, he still would have had numerous sexual predators on his campus. And on top of that, he would have employees embezzling millions of dollars and numerous other problems--and within a few years, there would again be 18-year-olds repeatedly slamming their heads against each other on a Penn State football field for little or no pay… and Spanier would have immediately lost his job.
People can say, "Raping is bad, saving the whales is good." Well, sure, that's easy to say. Who's going to disagree with that? But try to be the one who manages the neuroses of all the people at your school. Try to make it perfect. Try to eliminate everything that's bad. Try to do it in the context of the numerous settlements made by previous school presidents. Try to do it with all the fucktardedness that can't be uprooted.
Daily, I am haunted by these things and much, much more. I feel the utter despair of having made choices that just weren't good enough--like De Niro when he returned to Nam and tried so desperately to save his friend. There are so many times when you've got to work within the fucked-up system and play the fucked-up game in the current fucked-up culture, and accept the lesser of two evils (or the least of many evils).
ReplyDeleteI'm not defending any coach or any school administrator. I only know my own experiences.
I just know that I have too often felt like De Niro at the end of that scene. And in that context, I know I have said, "I wish I had done more." But in the moment, and in the complexity, and in the fucked-up culture, and with all the limitations and secrets and compromises and so on, it's not easy at all to know what should have been done.
This is such an imperfectly-written comment, and I could just keep writing on and on and on. I'm reminded of the last scene in Schindler's List when Schindler realizes he could have sold his wedding ring and saved a few more Jews from being killed. Or in The Fog of War when Macnamara acknowledges that he made decisions as Secretary of Defense, knowing that a couple thousand troops would die because of his decision. Why I have movies on my mind this morning, I don't know. But this I would say: If you don't like the decisions being made by the chief, then why don't you be the chief and fix it all? It sounds harsh, doesn't it? You say you wouldn't be allowed to be the chief, right? The only way you could be the chief would be if you cut a deal or sold your soul or something? Right, it's painful and it's not easy.
Bubba:
ReplyDeleteI hate that scene in Schindler's List. Ruins the whole movie.
Not knowing the particulars of your situation, it's hard to say anything truly relevant or comforting. Maybe you don't deserve to feel better. I don't know.
I've not come across any pederasts, at least that I know, but I've certainly come across abusers. Teachers that harass their students. Many of them.
I was never in the position to do anything, because it was always rumor, always through a third party. Students and professors told me things about Professor X. No student that was actually harassed told me anything. Everyone knew the rumors were true. (Honestly, I've never heard bad shit like that about a prof that actually wasn't DOING bad shit.) But what could be done? I was not harassed. No student had come to me personally (in which case I would have been required to report it to the university).
Universities are no better than football programs, in many cases. They don't want a scandal. They don't want everything splashed all over the local papers. When push comes to shove, in my experience, the harasser just quietly resigns. But it takes a long time for that to happen. A LOOOOONG time. Harassers are very canny people. They usually choose their victims wisely. But eventually, they pick on the wrong person. A person with rich, influential parents. And then the university simply forces the harasser out.
There is one case...a gentleman of my particular vintage, who had been teaching at my university for 15 years, was abruptly fired. Not asked to resign. Fired. He was a very visible prof on campus, winner of the "professor of the year" award a few years ago. For as long as I've been here, I've heard the worst sort of things about him. Sex with every female student he could seduce, that sort of thing. It took 15 years for the pigeons to come home to roost.
You can take heart in that it actually is better than it was 25 years ago. Back then, I know of cases where a woman reported abuse and was told by the abuser's colleagues (one a woman) that it would be better for her not to report it, because people wouldn't believe her, and it would just make her look bad. Jesus.
The focus on Paterno is not odd, btw. It's perfectly understandable. Other people are far more guilty than he is, but it makes a better story to project most of the blame on him. And the scandal needs a lightning rod. No one knows who the administrators are. Everyone knows Joe Paterno.
It takes forever to get rid of an abuser. I know of one with a lengthy track record of targetting junior female academics in vulnerable positions (untenured; adjunct; just coming up for tenure that year; students). Even so, some of them have complained, and the university has a lengthy file on him. Has anything happened? Well, after another recent incident the university has finally decided to - form a committee to study the situation. I'm sure that will produce a speedy and fair resolution..
ReplyDelete